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Post by Kieran on Feb 2, 2011 16:41:45 GMT -5
I never got the "extended trial" thing. Firstly, I never expect to be able to not pay for something and then get anything more than a trial. That makes no sense. To get a full game for free by a company that needs money is just flat out weird to me. Which leads me to the second point - You can play the game from top to bottom - how is that a trial, exactly. It is a trial in the way that, you can play it, if you don't like it, leave, if you do, spend something, if you're like "Meh." then don't spend anything... And PLAY! You can play for as long as you want, which is more than you can say for any trial out there. They all have time or content restrictions. So you could call it extended in that you can play the full game without having to decide. But that raises the question - what is the difference between an "extended trial" and a game? Subscription MMOs going from free trials to f2p is going to be a more common occurrence. Turbine proved just how viable the process is by at least quadrupling their income with both DDO and then LOTRO. Unfortunately CO did not follow their example and instead made their conversion more like SoE did with EQ2. Cryptic gave nearly all their content away for free, and are trying to get the free trials to subscribe instead of trying to get the same cash out of them without them subscribing. In the end I doubt that CO will even be as successful as EQ2, and nowhere near as successful as the two Turbine properties. There is far less incentive to subscribe or to make freeform characters here, even subscribers are making ATs to play and PvP with, and I'd bet most people that play here for free will not spend a single cent before getting bored and moving on. This is what I'm afraid of. Much of the fun and passing of time came from fiddling with Custom Frameworks. The idea that you not only customized the look of your hero but also defined his powers was delightful. I mean, I'm willing to bet that every person who has not lived under a rock over the past hundred years has envisioned what his ideal hero would look like and what his powers would be. CO delivered on this regard in a phenomenal way - and to deny that to Silver members reduces CO from a unique and amazing MMORPG to a very aesthetically customizable but ultimately standard MMORPG. And thus I fear that people are going try it out and then get bored quickly, just as you said. And Zedbrightlander, I thoroughly agree with you. Renting a game holds no appeal for me (Star Wars: The Old Republic is an exception) - I'd much rather invest my money into something that won't disappear as soon as I stop the cash flowing into it.
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Post by rubby on Feb 2, 2011 18:34:38 GMT -5
But I am thinking about subscribing to the game. I just have to gather some money and then I can do it.
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Post by zansatsu on Feb 2, 2011 18:42:53 GMT -5
Half of the customization has been removed for silver accounts. I'm only on a silver account and I've been playing for 2 days, I'm level 16 and more than the time I've spent playing the game, I've been customizing new characters only to delete them, knowing that no matter how awesome they look, they'll never be the one I want to play, cause the archetypes suck, I've been reading up on the archetypes and some of them doesn't even have the correct stats.
And so I thought "To get something out of this FREE to play-game.... I need to PAY, when it's FREE".
Yeah, I wrote the keywords in caps to make sure that everyone can actually get my point here...
I'm not saying the whole game should be free, don't misunderstand me on that point (might be easy to do), but the core of the game should, and people are saying that they need to get some more cash to be able to add more content. What they don't seem to understand however is that this is not adding content, it's modifying content, it's a block that just has to be removed.
Character Customization is a large part of the game core if the core is split in half, then it's a half finished game.... feels like playing age of conan again.
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Post by Admin on Feb 2, 2011 19:15:59 GMT -5
Some of the response in this thread kind of make me sad. I totally understand the desire to truly customize your character, and as I've said before if this idea can make as much money for Cryptic as they are currently making then I'm all for it. But some people sound like Cryptic has taken something from them, when its actually just the opposite. You are getting to play the game for free. It might not be exactly how you would like, but once again, its free. It would be nice if people appreciated that, but sadly some do not.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 2, 2011 19:37:20 GMT -5
Half of the customization has been removed for silver accounts. ... ... Character Customization is a large part of the game core if the core is split in half, then it's a half finished game.... feels like playing age of conan again. Imagine Champions Online as if it were a bakery and the characters you play were different types of cakes it offered and C-Store items were pastries. Silver membership would be a cart sitting outside the door with a variety of cakes and eclairs. You can't have the cakes decorated in any special way but they're free. The eclairs are available at a somewhat reasonable(subject to interpretation) price. Gold membership would be you walking in the bakery and having a cake made to your exact specifications with the added bonus that you can also walk out with as many eclairs as you can stand. All for a monthly fee. As a business they want people to order cakes but they also understand that some people just want a plain chocolate cake with no frills or fancy decorations so they make the plain chocolate cake free with the hope and mild expectation that some people will want more. It's not "punishment" it's business. One can always resubscribe if they miss having their cake and decorating it too.
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Post by Roxstar on Feb 2, 2011 20:03:27 GMT -5
I've been playing for 2 days, I'm level 16 and more than the time I've spent playing the game, I've been customizing new characters only to delete them, knowing that no matter how awesome they look, they'll never be the one I want to play, cause the archetypes suck, I've been reading up on the archetypes and some of them doesn't even have the correct stats. Woah, run-on much? Anywayz, what exactly do you mean by "doesn't even have the correct stats?" If you are reading old guides then you are quite mistaken. Passives now scale with ALL superstats...save a few (Defiance). These were tested by highly experienced players so I seriously doubt there are any wrong stats assigned to any ATs.
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Post by dysmetria on Feb 2, 2011 20:08:03 GMT -5
I've been playing for 2 days, I'm level 16 and more than the time I've spent playing the game, I've been customizing new characters only to delete them, knowing that no matter how awesome they look, they'll never be the one I want to play, cause the archetypes suck, I've been reading up on the archetypes and some of them doesn't even have the correct stats. Woah, run-on much? Anywayz, what exactly do you mean by "doesn't even have the correct stats?" If you are reading old guides then you are quite mistaken. Passives now scale with ALL superstats...save a few (Defiance). These were tested by highly experienced players so I seriously doubt there are any wrong stats assigned to any ATs. I imagine he meant that he would rather pick superstats that did more for his characters, such as CON for more hit points. Isn't that how it works for freeform characters? Don't they get to pick whatever superstats they want?
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Post by Kieran on Feb 2, 2011 20:57:47 GMT -5
Isn't that how it works for freeform characters? Don't they get to pick whatever superstats they want? Yes, Free-Forms get to choose everything including superstats. Some of the response in this thread kind of make me sad. I totally understand the desire to truly customize your character, and as I've said before if this idea can make as much money for Cryptic as they are currently making then I'm all for it. But some people sound like Cryptic has taken something from them, when its actually just the opposite. You are getting to play the game for free. It might not be exactly how you would like, but once again, its free. It would be nice if people appreciated that, but sadly some do not. But at the same time, your words are a little bit off too. While many Silver members feel that they are entitled to free content (which they aren't), many Gold members are also mistaken in that they seem to think that Cryptic is being generous by allowing Silver members to play for free, and thus demanding more free content is whiny and ungrateful (not that anything you said just now was along these lines). This too isn't the case, however. Cryptic didn't make CO FTP out of the goodness their hearts. They made it FTP because CO wasn't generating enough revenue with just subscribers, so they turned to the FTP community for money. Because of this, it isn't wrong for Silver members to ask for more free content, nor should Silver members find it necessary to appreciate the free content - because Cryptic isn't doing it to be nice. And in this case, Cryptic has indeed taken away a major portion of the game from Silver members - but this was just because they decided that this was how they wanted to run their FTP model. While it is my opinion that this is a bad business move on their parts (to be cutting off content from the people they hope to generate revenue from), this remains to be seen.
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Post by Roxstar on Feb 2, 2011 21:14:26 GMT -5
Isn't that how it works for freeform characters? Don't they get to pick whatever superstats they want? Yes, Free-Forms get to choose everything including superstats. That still doesn't mean that the SS's for ATs are wrong. Because of this, it isn't wrong for Silver members to ask for more free content, nor should Silver members find it necessary to appreciate the free content - because Cryptic isn't doing it to be nice. And in this case, Cryptic has indeed taken away a major portion of the game from Silver members - but this was just because they decided that this was how they wanted to run their FTP model. While it is my opinion that this is a bad business move on their parts (to be cutting off content from the people they hope to generate revenue from), this remains to be seen. But your business model cuts off content. Their's just cuts off customization. The problem with your model is that it's pretty highly understood that CO's leveling content is okay...not great but not bad. The fact that you are so adamant about flipping it to provide the customization side for free instead shows just how important it really is to people. THAT is why Cryptic did it the way they did. The sole draw to CO is customization, if you give that for free no one will want anything else and hence Cryptic will lose more money. Again, I say the model Cryptic has set up will work. And will work very well. I'm sure they didn't just hire random people off the street to run their marketing department. And I seriously doubt they made this decision with little to no research. I'm sorry but it still seems like the arguments we had before and during beta. You want more for less...and that is definitely not going to bring in more revenue.
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Post by Kieran on Feb 2, 2011 21:29:49 GMT -5
But your business model cuts off content. Their's just cuts off customization. The problem with your model is that it's pretty highly understood that CO's leveling content is okay...not great but not bad. The fact that you are so adamant about flipping it to provide the customization side for free instead shows just how important it really is to people. THAT is why Cryptic did it the way they did. The sole draw to CO is customization, if you give that for free no one will want anything else and hence Cryptic will lose more money. Again, I say the model Cryptic has set up will work. And will work very well. I'm sure they didn't just hire random people off the street to run their marketing department. And I seriously doubt they made this decision with little to no research. I'm sorry but it still seems like the arguments we had before and during beta. You want more for less...and that is definitely not going to bring in more revenue. I don't propose that any content be cut off. I believe the whole game can be easily Silver member content. I also do not believe that everything should be given out for free, though. My idea is advocating the selling of Free-Form character slots in the C-Store. Read Reply #7 to see some ideas that could overcome a few problems that have been proposed with this concept so far. Just because Cryptic is a company doesn't mean they are incapable of making bad decisions. And you're right - this is probably the same debate that was discussed during beta. Only then, there weren't any Silver members who were available to give their opinions.
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Post by Admin on Feb 2, 2011 21:36:14 GMT -5
And in this case, Cryptic has indeed taken away a major portion of the game from Silver members I think this is where alot of people are getting confused. You cant take something "away" from someone unless they had it to begin with. F2P launched with silver players being limited to archetypes, so no one who has created a new free character has had anything taken away with them. Now, would it be nice to have more options? Of course! But that doesnt change the fact of what I just said.
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Post by kingkilingin on Feb 2, 2011 21:45:45 GMT -5
I agree 110% with Admin here. For me personally, the game going F2P is a blessing I would never have asked for. I didn't even know about it until Massively wrote the article reminding us that it is going F2P.
What Cradock wants, and most silvers, is the OPTION to have free form. CO didn't take away anything. They just didn't gave us that one thing we covet the most. YET.
I know most silvers are new to the game and as such, I do not think we are experienced enough to be able to fully enjoy Free Form. I have a friend log in for the first time last night and his biggest problem was that he was too zoomed in. We could probably ask for the free form once the silvers get enough experience on their own because otherwise, people would just be asking people for what is best to this, what fits into what - basically just an archetype determined by player's experiences.
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Post by dysmetria on Feb 2, 2011 22:13:56 GMT -5
While many Silver members feel that they are entitled to free content (which they aren't) Where exactly do you see these "many" silver members saying they feel that way? I've seen no silvers in these forums nor in the PC and Technical issues forum on the official CO website claiming such a thing.
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Post by dysmetria on Feb 2, 2011 22:20:40 GMT -5
What Cradock wants, and most silvers, is the OPTION to have free form. CO didn't take away anything. They just didn't gave us that one thing we covet the most. YET. Most silvers haven't played freeform characters or even know what they are. The ones that "covet" it "the most" are mainly among the handful of former subscribers trying to play as silvers.
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Post by jestersmiles on Feb 2, 2011 22:27:49 GMT -5
Well I for one ( I am silver once sub.) don't see nothing wrong with the current model , but it will be nice to have the option to buy a free form slot but not needed. I will rather have the option to buy the ability to change the colors of my powers. Plus I am a altoholic ,so once I get my main to level cap I start making alts, but I do feel kinda worry that the game been out since 2009 and no major expansion yet
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