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Post by higirls on May 28, 2012 11:22:03 GMT -5
Idea: what if we put together some of the do's and dont's in Alert teamups? Many players have never played team content at all, so even writing down the most basic notions could be helpful: CC and CS are for threat, healers healing is good, healers attacking while team dies is bad, pulling multiple groups at once is bad, stuff like that. The teamwork situation is mostly horrible in PUGs, but this forum has quite a few views so maybe something can be done about it So, as I wrote above: - Tanks should use attacks with the Crippling Challenge and Challenging Strikes to draw threat; heroes without a defensive passive should not use attacks with these advantages when on a team. - Never attack an enemy that is not currently engaged if your team is fighting already; it will pull one extra mob into the fight, usually make people die, and always make your team mad at you. - Healers should heal as much as possible. It usually pays off to heal aggressively, as your teammates will be able to focus on their damage output once they know they're being backed up by a healer. Keep in mind that in alerts some healers will NOT heal- even ATs like mind who can't really do anything else; your teammates will only know they have heals on their side once they notice you're actually healing things. And a bit more: - Look at the positioning of your teammates; if you're too far you may end up pulling other mobs (see above), and you may not benefit from things like auras and heals. - Always know who the boss is targeting: click on the boss and you can see it on the right, near the portrait. Be careful when it switches targets, as it could attack you; in this case, dps and healers should consider blocking or fighting defensively until they lose aggro or until someone heals them. - Healers should often heal the player who is eating the boss attacks. You can do this by targeting the boss and using your heal, as it will automatically heal the enemy's current target. - Use your block to mitigate the charged attacks from the enemies, especially if you don't have a defensive passive. These are top of my list, but there's many more things everyone can do to make PUGs less frustrating. Feel free to add anything that comes to your mind. I would also really appreciate it if some of the veterans added some hints, as they probably know things I don't about working as a team
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Post by lezard2102 on May 28, 2012 22:54:15 GMT -5
Smash AlertsDockside Dustup/Two Minute Drill:It is really important for the tank to aggro both the boss and the mobs. Not doing so will cause the mobs, or worse the boss, to target the healer when he attempts to heal you and kill him. DPS must FIRST kill the mobs. This will make the job much easier on both the Tank and the Healer. Plus better kill what dies easily first instead of failing after killing boss for not being able to find the mob that is still alive. Healers must keep an eye on both the Tank and the main DPS health. In this kind of Smash dealing damage fast is really important, so if the main DPS is dieing a lot, or having to back away to regenerate HP, you will probably fail. Priority goes Tank>DPS, but you should definitely heal DPS when you get the chance. Also, don't start healing till Tank/DPSes aggro mobs. IMPORTANT!! Flight can either be a gift or a curse. Black Fang for example only has a Lunge which he will only use if you are far away, so Tanking mid range while airborne will require less healing, allowing Healer to join in the DPS. HOWEVER, some bosses like Viper X like to join in on the airborne fight fun if provoked. If you see most of your DPS are melee without a flight power, lure Viper X back to land, or you will lose. Soul SiphonAfter patched, the boss can no longer be lured away from central square, he will start running back to a certain spot or switch aggro if you try to lure him to far away. This is annoying for melee DPS cause the boss will move around too much. This is however one of the easiest Smash, so as long as you don't fight him right in the middle aggroing all worms you should do fine. Recruitment DriveThis is the one that most people fail, when in fact, is also one of the easiest Smash. There are 4 groups of enemies in the square + Boss, and you only need to kill one before luring boss back to police car. Unlike Soul Siphon, you can lure the boss away from the center this way. Fighting the boss in the middle will result in a guaranteed fail, cause Bosses like to backstep, specially when they switch target, and in the case of Hi Pan, can be knocked into other groups of mobs. Unlike Two Minute Drill/Dockside Dustup, mobs here are of the Enforcer/Master Villain level, so they can kill teams fast is disturbed. TrainstoppingMistake here is wanting to rush things. A REALLY GOOD TANK, that is to say, someone you completely trust and have run many Alerts with, in company of a REALLY GOOD HEALER (Same as with Tank) can Aggro all mob groups and maintain aggro while DPS go on AoE fest. If you don't have the REALLY GOOD TANK AND HEALER, then let the tank aggro one group at a time while healer heals, and DPS AoE or take down individual enemies. Either the Boss or the group of 2 Enforcer + Master Villain on the back should be left for last, while taking care of the other 3 groups should be done first. The difference between each method is of about 20-30 seconds, which isn't such a big difference, so if you are unsure, do things the safe way. Hope this was useful
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Post by plinske on May 29, 2012 6:44:53 GMT -5
What I most hate in pug alerts are knock spam. Another day a guy in my group started spamming Pillar of Poz spreading mob everywhere aggroing even more mobs ...
Another thing are pet builds, with a simple knock those lazzy pets run like crazy behind the mob bringing endless waves of mobs.
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Post by higirls on May 29, 2012 17:35:42 GMT -5
One thing I really, really hate is enemy knocking toons away from the team and right in the middle of another mob that will first eviscerate them and then proceed to attack the team. And there's not much to do about it Smash AlertsRecruitment DriveThis is the one that most people fail, when in fact, is also one of the easiest Smash. I think one of the reasons is that every death speeds the recruiting process- it's the same as losing some seconds on a timer for every death on your team, in addition to the dps loss. And with lots of lv 6 who don't know what block is... Smash AlertsTrainstoppingA REALLY GOOD TANK, that is to say, someone you completely trust and have run many Alerts with, in company of a REALLY GOOD HEALER (Same as with Tank) can Aggro all mob groups and maintain aggro while DPS go on AoE fest. I don't think it's feasible unless your tank and healer are really, really good. And not just "decent archetype & knows what he's doing" good: I mean min/maxed lv 40 FF good, at least the tank. The chances of findig such a team is pretty low, so I have to advise against trying this on a PUG.
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Post by lezard2102 on May 30, 2012 6:38:04 GMT -5
I don't think it's feasible unless your tank and healer are really, really good. And not just "decent archetype & knows what he's doing" good: I mean min/maxed lv 40 FF good, at least the tank. The chances of findig such a team is pretty low, so I have to advise against trying this on a PUG. I am a Behemoth. I run this with a Radiant from my SG and we do it this way. In fact from own experience, the limiteness of skills and advantages a Behemoth can do makes him a better Tank than 80% of the FF tanks. That is, if the player knows what he is doing, otherwise knockback Behemoths make for the worst tanks. I personally have always played tank classes in MMORPGs so I do know what I am supposed to do, and can hold aggro even against a min/max DPS FF with DW crit.
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Post by higirls on May 30, 2012 7:13:03 GMT -5
I am a Behemoth. I run this with a Radiant from my SG and we do it this way Kudos, this is pretty impressive. I still believe it's better to pick the groups one by one though.
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Post by championsolplayer on Jun 1, 2012 11:48:25 GMT -5
Addendum. They are YOUR teammates, keep an eye on their Health and Energy. A quick glance at the team window will help.
Don't go grabbing all the power-ups esp. if YOUR energy and health are fine, your team mate may need that health or energy and may be planning to get it.
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Post by lezard2102 on Jun 1, 2012 19:25:46 GMT -5
I am a Behemoth. I run this with a Radiant from my SG and we do it this way Kudos, this is pretty impressive. I still believe it's better to pick the groups one by one though. You probably didn't read this part. I even posted the time difference between each method. I'm even recommending the safe way. Don't go grabbing all the power-ups esp. if YOUR energy and health are fine, your team mate may need that health or energy and may be planning to get it. Don't go grabbing orbs period. Leave them to the tank. AoE damage is minimal if you know how to block, whereas tank needs it to survive single target attacks. If tank dies the team is next on the line, and you risk a fail.
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Post by higirls on Jun 1, 2012 19:42:27 GMT -5
One thing I forgot: please do not queue before you have a passive and 3 super stats Not being able to contribute to the fight puts a burden on the team and some players may not react well. And it doesn't take a lot of time to get to the late teens in this game anyway. I even posted the time difference between each method. I'm even recommending the safe way. We agree. I probably chose the wrong words. Sorry
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Post by Deleted on Jun 2, 2012 19:18:37 GMT -5
In timer based alerts, Trainstopping/Dockside/Two-minutes, if you are low on health and have no heal, just DIE. You come back with a fresh pool of health and wipe any aggression on you.
Don't be one of those that block and run around staying out of the fight the entire alert just because you got hit and are near dying right at the start. These people will whine about losing stars, but stars mean nothing compared to the DPS you will be doing while actually fighting. Also, if you need stars to be any effective at all in an alert, that's already not a good sign.
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Post by lezard2102 on Jun 2, 2012 20:33:51 GMT -5
In timer based alerts, Trainstopping/Dockside/Two-minutes, if you are low on health and have no heal, just DIE. You come back with a fresh pool of health and wipe any aggression on you. Don't be one of those that block and run around staying out of the fight the entire alert just because you got hit and are near dying right at the start. These people will whine about losing stars, but stars mean nothing compared to the DPS you will be doing while actually fighting. Also, if you need stars to be any effective at all in an alert, that's already not a good sign. This! Seriously this! Specially the NO running part. I will also like to add in those same events, at the start of battle for DPS to control their damage while the tank builds proper aggro, don't go Intensify + full charged DW crit off the bat, cause you will be flashing red in no time at all.
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Post by higirls on Jun 3, 2012 3:52:09 GMT -5
These people will whine about losing stars, but stars mean nothing compared to the DPS you will be doing while actually fighting. I don't agree. If you're the only lv. 40 dps you will probably do enough damage to strip the aggro off the team in a matter of seconds if no one is tanking well. Die, respawn, lose a star, get back in the fight, get all the aggro back after 2 or 3 attacks, and then die again? I will try to do some damage while staying alive, but when it's not possible I'll just hide behind my block until I lose the aggro or get some healing.
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Post by PoochieHellhound on Jun 3, 2012 3:55:21 GMT -5
These people will whine about losing stars, but stars mean nothing compared to the DPS you will be doing while actually fighting. I don't agree. If you're the only lv. 40 dps you will probably do enough damage to strip the aggro off the team in a matter of seconds if no one is tanking well. Die, respawn, lose a star, get back in the fight, get all the aggro back after 2 or 3 attacks, and then die again ? No thanks, I'll just hide behind my block until I lose the aggro. So instead of dying, coming back and getting aggro in 2 seconds you will block for 15-20 seconds, lose aggro, and then regain aggro in 2 seconds?
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Post by higirls on Jun 3, 2012 3:58:25 GMT -5
So instead of dying, coming back and getting aggro in 2 seconds you will block for 15-20 seconds, lose aggro, and then regain aggro in 2 seconds? Yes. No one else has to defend while I block, and activating a form and a travel power and getting back into the fight takes time too. Of course I don't advocate turtling up behind the block and doing nothing for fear of damage: I try to do as much dmg as possible even if targeted. But when I have low hp, no heals, no available active defense and no defensive moves, it comes down to death or block, and I say block.
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Post by lezard2102 on Jun 3, 2012 11:43:02 GMT -5
I don't agree. If you're the only lv. 40 dps you will probably do enough damage to strip the aggro off the team in a matter of seconds if no one is tanking well. Die, respawn, lose a star, get back in the fight, get all the aggro back after 2 or 3 attacks, and then die again? I will try to do some damage while staying alive, but when it's not possible I'll just hide behind my block until I lose the aggro or get some healing. This is incorrect. Lets suppose that you die after boss loses 1/3rd of his life. When you die aggro on you gets completely cleaned, whereas your fellow lowlevel teammembers have 1/3rd of Hp damage worth of aggro. You will eventually regain aggro, but not in 2 seconds, you will regain it after a considerable amount of damage say between half bar-1 bar of Hp, or when boss kills and cycles through all your other inept party members. Whereas if you block till another team member outmatches your aggro by 2 units, you will immediately get it back, even if you use an energy builder. Though truth be told, if you are in the circumstance where you are surrounded by level 6-10s, the only viable option for timed events is Socrates->Leave current map.
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