Cursed / Scourge Guide

[orintakoda]

Jan 20, 2012 15:36:28 GMT -5 Criswolf09 said:

Hi again, I was trygin to create a toon like spawn with the chain powers, so check out my build
Powers:
Level 1: Infernal Bolts
Level 1: Infernal Blast -- Virulent Propagation
Level 6: Condemn -- Rank 2, Redemption Denied
Level 6: Power Flight -- Rank 2
Level 8: Pestilence -- Rank 3, Rank 2
Level 11: Vicious Cyclone -- Rank 3, Rank 2
Level 14: Ebon Void -- Voracious Darkness, Rank 2
Level 17: Crippling Coils -- Rank 2, Barbed Chains
Level 22: Supernatural Power
Level 27: Aspect Of The Infernal -- Rank 3, Rank 2
Level 32: Epidemic -- Rank 3, Rank 2
Level 35: Teleport
Level 40: Defile -- Plague Bearer, Rank 2

Any advice is welcome, thanks

With your Crippling Coils, I would suggest switching Condemn's Redemption Denied with Vicious Cyclone's Vortex Technique, other than that, seems like a nice build.

[brocephalus]

Jan 19, 2012 13:55:01 GMT -5 eviltaco said:

I'd disagree with some of what you took. I play one of these as my main right now, so lemme explain what I've found.

vicious cyclone with vortex technique pulls mobs to you, while knocking them for a half a second, which interrupts charged attacks and holds. That's more useful than you think. It also gives a free stack of enrage, so spinning that chain while you're not fighting is the same as tapping howl. Venomous breath feels like a low-rent epidemic, so why bother taking a redundant power that doesn't have an added advantage? Heck, you took condemn with redemption denied, that's already an aoe stun, with a 9s paralyze on the main target. You know the paralyzing venom with venomous breath is only 1.5, right? I went to the same place you did, at first, with that pick. Then I retrained and never looked back.

Also, acrobatics r3 and advantage should be the primary travel power. Nailed to the ground doesn't remove versatility, so you can still kite people in pvp, and circle jumping/acrospazzing is kinda par for the course for squishies in pvp. It's great for pve, too, especially when farming. Run around with epidemic through crowds, stacking a bit of poison. if you just keep running, the stuff behind you's dead before it can catch you. I basically suicide run through entire instances like that, and I nearly never die. if a boss is involved I run through him, get the next pack or 2 past him, then pop back and coils him before charging a defile. He's dead, next group. Not to mention, and don't forget, teleport has a lockdown if you enter combat after using it. I can't be alone in using acro to aoe the area someone teleports from, to tick em out of tp and lock em down.

'course, I also took nailed to the ground on condemn rather than coils. it's aoe. finding aoe nailed to the ground in this game is really rare, and I know at the least people thank me for it in demonflame and aftershock.

Just a few thoughts.

Hey dude, thanks for posting, I knew it would only be a matter of time before someone who played the AT would point out my ignorance .

I agree Vicious Cyclone and the Vortex technique is actually very decent for PvE, I am prolly gunna change the guide to incorporate them. I agree Veno Breath is pretty much Epidemic, but weaker in every single way.

I, as a rule of thumb make my guides for newbies who may not be all that confident with what they want or what they think / know is good from their personal experience. This is why I always advice Teleport as the first TP since it allows you to easily escape and skip through portions of trash mobs. For the PvE build. Epidemic + Acro definitely is amazing and I would definitely advice in getting it (at the very least as your second TP, since Epidemic is gained at lvl 32 and the 2nd TP is gained at lvl 35).

Nailed to the Ground on Condemn is definitely an option.

All in all I must have gotten caught up with the Bleeding > Stun combo of Veno Breath + Crip Coils without seeing the more practical aspects of simply grabbing Vicious Cyclone and abusing the Enraged! buff + the fact you can draw in ranged critters for a more potent Epidemic (since more enemies will be hit by it).

[brocephalus]

Jan 21, 2012 1:31:33 GMT -5 Criswolf09 said:

And speaking about talents selection, I think dex would be nice instead of intelligence, what do you think?

Dexterity can be good, but its not an SS, you have no powers that scale with Dexterity specifically and your DoTs don't crit, losing a lot of the power that dexterity provides. Given this, I would rather grab Intelligence and just be able to use more powers more often.

[secksegai]

Some suggestions

Cursed is one of the strongest ATs for general pve/pvp - unlike soldier where you lose a rank in AR for CC, your core damage abilities won't be losing points to CC or NttG.

Deciding between breath or cyclone is still reasonable. I pvp regularly with my Cursed and found neither to be overwhelmingly superior to the other

Until the ego changes hit, a character will generally be lacking in scaling stats for the knock in cyclone. The biggest threats you would use cyclone to interrupt tend to have high knock resists and you'll generally be held or stunned before you can get the knock off to interrupt. Breath is convenient for both pve/pvp and the chance to stun can serve as an interrupt chance as well. Its one of the few powers I'll use all 5 potential adv points in (r3, paralytic).

Tele and Acro or Tele and flight would be the two main travels I'd recommend. Acro over flight simply because you can get flight from a device where as there's no acro equivalent device. Because of the mobility offered by epidemic and defile, not using acro will slow down pve and flight's very limited in pvp with NttG. Also, anything using acro should make use of versatility.

I wouldn't drop 2 points in Infernal blast since defile is better suited for the task and you should only need it for breaking blocks.

Epidemic R2 and outbreak is generally more effective. The reduction in cast time makes it easier to double stack poisons. The dots are particularly effective against heavy defenses. It's always fun killing 4-5 folks in single pass in ZA unrestricted just through epidemic alone. Even if you're defeated, the dots still deal damage. Also, against heavy duty sing targets, debuffing with defile as needed and sticking with epidemic will deal more damage than straight defile. The dot stacks easily make up for the damage lost by the missing rank.

I run r2/NttG in my coils since the AT doesn't synergize well with bleed. Sure you get boosted stun chances in a power or two but the slashing/bleed damage is no way worth the 3 points.

I don't like relying on condemn for NttG in Pvp - but it works great for pve. A big reason for this is to reduce buttons pressed in executing combos etc.

Talent choices should be based upon final equipment. At least for min/maxing, but it does help fill any needed gaps without resorting to equipment.

Endurance should always be considered in rec builds otherwise energy goes to waste. Having rec as an SS means you're guaranteed to surpass your total energy bar in potential equilibrium unless end is added to compensate.

Until the new changes hit, dex is a poor stat since you can't stack enough ego/dex for consistent damage improvement.

Offense stat is reasonable in rec builds since you can get a larger damage boost than improving stats alone. (mainly for primary offense slot)

Until the new changes hit, Rec/Con/End should be the stats to focus on for the AT. Rec is up to preference after hitting 200, Con wherever you can fit it, and end at least to even your equilibrium to your total energy. Intel is also a valuable stat as you can generally slot enough to reduce costs, particularly useful for when you need to spam defile.

Str is also something to consider, as the knock resistance can be helpful (albeit very limited) and does scale the enrage stack. Being that you're only stacking one you won't get a significant improvement.

Until the ego changes hit, there's no real reason to stat ego, there's simply better alternatives.

[higirls]

Took Venomous Breath over Vicious Cyclone because it doesn't lock me down, allowing me to sprint around with acro+ versatility, catching every enemy in the AoE and spreading pestilence. I also suppose its better for pvp since moving is good . I'm not sure if I'll rank it, although getting to lv 32 with only R1 attacks sounds pretty boring.

[aruka]

venomous breath is your stronger skill before you get epidemic, also if you choised chains as your hold power with barbed chains adv and got the adv on venomous breath you can get from 5 to 10 stacks of deadly poison in a single mantain, also its kinda good in pvp as a replacement to epidemic when you really dont want to get anything near to close to your opponent (ie; unleashed)

[Deleted]

(All stats are rank 5 mods)

Superstats:
Primary: Recovery
Secondary: Ego/Constitution

Powers:
Level 1: Infernal Bolts
Level 1: Infernal Blast (Crippling Challenge)
Level 6: Acrobatics (R3, Versatility)
Level 6: Condemn
Level 8: Pestilence (R3)
Level 11: Venomous Breath (Paralytic Bile)
Level 14: Aspect of the Infernal
Level 17: Crippling Coils (Nailed to the Ground, Barbed Chains)
Level 21: Ebon Void (R3, Voracious Darkness)
Level 25: Supernatural Power
Level 30: Resurgence (R3)
Level 35: Epidemic (R3)
Level 35: Flight (R3)
Level 40: Defile: Sustained DPS:(R2, Plague Bearer, Accelerated Metabolism) or Spike damage:(R3, Accelerated Metabolism)

Talents:
+8 Recovery
+5 Recovery/Constitution
+5 Ego/Constitution
+5 Ego/Recovery
+5 Recovery/Endurance
+5 Endurance/Constitution

Specialisation:
Recovery: Gear Utilization (3/3)
Recovery: Staying Power (2/2)
Recovery: Super Charged (3/3)
Recovery: Efficient (2/3)
Overseer: Ruthless (2/2)
Overseer: Overseer Aura (3/3)
Overseer: Impact (2/2)
Overseer: Conservation (2/2)
Overseer: Enhanced Gear (1/3)
Avenger: Ruthless (2/2)
Avenger: Round 'em Up (3/3)
Avenger: Surprise Attack (2/2)
Avenger: Relentless Assault (3/3)
Mastery: Recovery Mastery (1/1)

Gear:
Primary Offense: [Heroic Gloves of Precision] + Gambler's Lucky Gem, Ego x2
Primary Defense: [Heroic Breastplate of Agility] + Gambler's Lucky Gem, Con x2
Primary Utility: [Heroic Helmet of Efficiency] + Gambler's Lucky Gem, Con x2
Secondary Offense: [Decisive Belt] +20 Ego +47 Crit Strike
Secondary Defense: [Garrison Bracers] +338 Max Health +37 Rec
Secondary Utility: [Remission Eyepiece] +37 Rec +93 Cost Discount

[higirls]

I have a cursed and don't like its trees at all: recovery is not as good as most of the other stat trees and overseer is mostly useless to a dps with no heals and shields. A pity since the AT itself is pretty good and would really shine with vindicator or guardian.

[Deleted]

Given what we have, I think the trees worked out pretty well for the Cursed/Scourge since Epidemic is it's main source of DPS, and anyone playing this AT should be launching with Defile for its debuff taking advantage of the alpha crit. This AT still has excellent DPS in my testing so far.

[petro678]

Why you didn't take hp regen and max hp points in specialization and also Trapped?

[Deleted]

I only chose the specialisations that are most beneficial to my ATs. The ones you mention are useless and a total waste of points.

Regen is over 3 secs so you take that heal and divide by 3, that won't save you from anything. Max HP and Energy is from your non-superstats, meaning you get next to nothing hp and zero extra energy. Your cc skills don't work on supervillians and above. Trying to hold 1 or a small area (with the long charging condemn) of easy to kill henchmen to master villian is more likely to get you killed when there's many enemies, when you could have easily killed them with epidemic.

[Deleted]

Updated my build and specialisation.

[eatmore]

Thanks so much for the updates, I'm leveling a cursed and your advice is very helpful.

Could you provide some details on the reasoning for your latest changes? I'm particularly curious why you dropped the condemn advantages and your thoughts on Epidemic R3 vs Outbreak and Defile R3 vs Plague.

It also looks like you dropped a spec tree choice for energy gain. How is energy management at level 40 with all the new spec tree options and new cost reduction gear?

[Deleted]

You may want to have the advantage on Condemn or rank Venomous Breath while leveling, but keep those ranks on the top of your retcon list, they become useless after getting epidemic.

Outbreak is unnecessary, Epidemic stacks Deadly Poison at a very fast rate, it's possible to get full stacks from 2 full maintains of it.

Defile R2 should kill henchmen outright (usually villains too with the 70% alpha crit), anything with large health pools and Plague Bearer deals more damage with a DoT on top of your Epidemic.

Which energy spec? At 40, you will never need to use energy builder to continuously spam epidemic maintains due to Supernatural Power. Provided you have a high enough Recovery, taken Staying Power spec as I suggested and use the Primary Utility Gear I recommended. If these 3 conditions are met, you won't need the 2 points in Efficient spec, these spare points you can put into Rapid Recovery for a small amount of health gain, though isn't much, but they are free points.

[higirls]

I actually disagree on taking plague bearer on Defile. It's your best single target dps; if you cast it constantly on a single target the bonus dmg from the adv is much smaller than the bonus you would get from the extra rank. I don't find it useful against groups either, as mob=epidemic spam.